I'm working my way backwards here, but I wonder when Paul met with the elders in Ephesus if he only met with his elders or if John's elders were also present. He seems anxious about wolves wheras John by contrast is not worried about wolves coming from within because "the light of love casts out all darkness." I wonder how much of Paul's woes were self inflicted in this case by over organising out of fear and then it coming to bite him in the blessed assurance.
If Paul did enact these hierchial changes in a moment of crises then it is on his head and he should have remembered the Galatians who started in the Spirit and attempted to go forward in the flesh. I still hold that his writings are likely over thought and we now see organisation where there was none or very little to begin.
If there were elders in the Johannine Ephesian church, they weren’t around until long after Paul’s death. But I would say John is very much worried about wolves from within. Judas is the arch wolf of the NT, and his character is most fully developed by John. In either case, I think you’re right to see the humanness of Paul’s strategies. We have too long elevated them to the status of divinely inspired universal absolutes. Ironically, Bruno Barnhart said that Galatians 3:28 was only a visionary dream in the Pauline churches, but it was fully realized in the Johannine churches.
Thank you for your work on this! Fascinating. Forgive me if you've already written this or I missed it - what exactly was the false teaching? Gnosticism? Or something else? Thank you!!
I didn’t actually spend much time studying that issue, and don’t really get into that in this series, but it’s a great question! It probably relates to the flexibility of ecclesial strategies used to address false teaching/teachers. I briefly previewed a book on Ephesians that uses the Ephesian Artemis cult as an interpretive lens for the entire book, and there are books and commentaries that use that context for interpreting 1 Timothy (eg Sandra Glahn, Nobody’s Mother). We see the Artemis cult clearly in Acts 19:23ff. There also appears to be some overlap with the disciples of John the Baptist in Ephesus (Acts 18:24-25; 19:3-4) and the Gospel of John’s intentional minimization of the Baptist vis a vis Jesus (eg 1:19-28, 30; 3:22-30). So some scholars believe there was ongoing debate between the disciples of Jesus and John the Baptist in Ephesus. The false teaching in the letters of John (to be discussed in part 4 of this series) is easier to identify, eg denial/minimization of the humanity of Jesus (1 John 4:2), over-realized eschatology/denial of remaining sin (1 John 1:5-10), etc., which some would characterize as proto-gnosticism. It would be great to flesh out this series with more nuance re: these various specific theological issues. Thanks for calling that to my attention!
“For the time will come when people will not tolerate sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, will multiply teachers for themselves because they have an itch to hear what they want to hear” 2 Tim 4:3.
This thought just came to me as I read the verse, it makes me think of senior pastors that put young men as “elders” in the church when the young (or even older men) are untested and inexperienced, especially in their
ability to hold an older man (often the pastor) accountable and/or voice a dissenting view/point. It seems many pastors want certain men to be elders bc the pastor wants to create a board of “yes men”
I'm working my way backwards here, but I wonder when Paul met with the elders in Ephesus if he only met with his elders or if John's elders were also present. He seems anxious about wolves wheras John by contrast is not worried about wolves coming from within because "the light of love casts out all darkness." I wonder how much of Paul's woes were self inflicted in this case by over organising out of fear and then it coming to bite him in the blessed assurance.
If Paul did enact these hierchial changes in a moment of crises then it is on his head and he should have remembered the Galatians who started in the Spirit and attempted to go forward in the flesh. I still hold that his writings are likely over thought and we now see organisation where there was none or very little to begin.
If there were elders in the Johannine Ephesian church, they weren’t around until long after Paul’s death. But I would say John is very much worried about wolves from within. Judas is the arch wolf of the NT, and his character is most fully developed by John. In either case, I think you’re right to see the humanness of Paul’s strategies. We have too long elevated them to the status of divinely inspired universal absolutes. Ironically, Bruno Barnhart said that Galatians 3:28 was only a visionary dream in the Pauline churches, but it was fully realized in the Johannine churches.
Thank you for your work on this! Fascinating. Forgive me if you've already written this or I missed it - what exactly was the false teaching? Gnosticism? Or something else? Thank you!!
I didn’t actually spend much time studying that issue, and don’t really get into that in this series, but it’s a great question! It probably relates to the flexibility of ecclesial strategies used to address false teaching/teachers. I briefly previewed a book on Ephesians that uses the Ephesian Artemis cult as an interpretive lens for the entire book, and there are books and commentaries that use that context for interpreting 1 Timothy (eg Sandra Glahn, Nobody’s Mother). We see the Artemis cult clearly in Acts 19:23ff. There also appears to be some overlap with the disciples of John the Baptist in Ephesus (Acts 18:24-25; 19:3-4) and the Gospel of John’s intentional minimization of the Baptist vis a vis Jesus (eg 1:19-28, 30; 3:22-30). So some scholars believe there was ongoing debate between the disciples of Jesus and John the Baptist in Ephesus. The false teaching in the letters of John (to be discussed in part 4 of this series) is easier to identify, eg denial/minimization of the humanity of Jesus (1 John 4:2), over-realized eschatology/denial of remaining sin (1 John 1:5-10), etc., which some would characterize as proto-gnosticism. It would be great to flesh out this series with more nuance re: these various specific theological issues. Thanks for calling that to my attention!
Thank you! Yes I'd personally be really interested in your work on this intersecting with what the false teachings were! I appreciate your reply!
“For the time will come when people will not tolerate sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, will multiply teachers for themselves because they have an itch to hear what they want to hear” 2 Tim 4:3.
This thought just came to me as I read the verse, it makes me think of senior pastors that put young men as “elders” in the church when the young (or even older men) are untested and inexperienced, especially in their
ability to hold an older man (often the pastor) accountable and/or voice a dissenting view/point. It seems many pastors want certain men to be elders bc the pastor wants to create a board of “yes men”
I’m enjoying this series, thanks for writing!